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Re: (ET) ok, not the fusible link
Open to high currents does not mean 'open to the extreme low current that
a power metr takes. A carbon track or rust across an open is enough to
move a voltmeter. Especially as it reads low I would suspect that. Look
carefully with good light to see if any connection (ends of both big and
small wires) show signs of getting hot. This would also make smoke from
burned insulation right at the wire terminal.
Dave
Weymouth MA
On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 22:08:49 -0400 (EDT) Michael S Briggs
<msbriggs alberti unh edu> writes:
>
> RJ,
> Alrighty, will do (tomorrow morning). It will be my first
> time
> doing anything on the drive motor - haven't touched it yet.
> Kind of funny - based on the schematics, I figured it could
> be
> CB-1 - but I thought that was the thermal breaker near the fuse
> panel. :)
> It may have failed - but it's seeming now like it should be
>
> something else, since after soldering that control fuse holder, I am
>
> seeing some voltage on the fuel gauge (doesn't seem to be reading
> accurately though), and from the schematic, it looks like the fuel
> gauge
> shouldn't read anything if CB-1 is open. Also, the PTO outlet isn't
> working, and CB-1 isn't on that circuit (at least it looks that way
> from
> the schematic).
> On the fuse holder - is there any way to fix the old one,
> or
> should the whole thing be replaced? So far, it's seemed like my
> attempt at
> soldering the connection there hasn't been very effective.
> Hm, just realized that I haven't tried running the lift
> motor
> since it died - I'm assuming it doesn't work, but knowing for sure
> might
> help isolate the problem. I'll try that in the morning too.
>
> Thanks,
> Mike
>
> --
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> Michael S. Briggs
> UNH Physics Department
> (603) 862-2828
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
> On Sat, 29 Jul 2006, RJ Kanary wrote:
>
> > Knowing now that you have an AA model..................<VBG>, I
> can tell
> > you that the early fuse holders were problematic. What ever fault
> cause the
> > fuse to open could well have finished off the holder as well.
> > Remember that bad high current connection that I suspected
> that you may
> > have, due to the motorboating and chattering that you had ? I
> think that you
> > just may find it now. Take a look at CB-1, that large Klixon®
> thermal limiter
> > on the traction motor case . If it has failed open, nothing would
> power up,
> > including the "Fuel Gauge".
> > Fix the fuse holder, investigate CB-1, and report back with
> your
> > findings. :)
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael S Briggs"
> > <msbriggs alberti unh edu>
> > To: "RJ Kanary" <rjkanary nauticom net>
> > Cc: <elec-trak cosmos phy tufts edu>
> > Sent: Saturday, July 29, 2006 9:08 PM
> > Subject: Re: (ET) ok, not the fusible link
> >
> >
> >>
> >> RJ,
> >> Mine's an AA.
> >> An update on what I've looked over:
> >> Since the fuel gauge wasn't showing anything, I decided to try
> tracking
> >> the path around it to see where the path was broken. From the
> positive end
> >> of the pack to the fuel gauge was fine, the problem was on the
> end from the
> >> - end of the pack to the fuel gauge. The path was fine to the
> fuse holder,
> >> and fine from the fuel gauge to the side of the fuse holder
> closest to it.
> >> So, that would seem to indicate blown fuse - but the fuse was
> fine. What I
> >> ended up finding was that with the fuse in the fuse holder, it
> had no
> >> connection to the screw terminal where the wires connect.
> >> I tried just cleaning everything out well, filing off any
> possible rust,
> >> and then sprayed it down with De-Oxit cleaner, but still nothing.
> >> The rivet connection where the fuse holder is connected to the
> plate that
> >> the screw is on (where the wires connect) was loose and wobbly,
> apparently
> >> not making a good connection. The other fuse holders looked nice
> and tight
> >> at that rivet, but not this one - so I figured maybe I had
> somehow weakened
> >> the rivet when I pulled out the blown fuse to replace it.
> >> So, I figured I'd try soldering that connection to make a better
> contact
> >> between the fuse holder and the screwed in connections. That may
> not have
> >> been a great idea (that block with the fuse holders connected
> doesn't seem
> >> to like the heat), but it did at least get it where now when I
> engage the
> >> power disconnect, I do get a reading on the fuel meter gauge -
> but it was
> >> much lower than it should have been, and still nothing works - no
> drive
> >> motor, no PTO, etc..
> >> So, for the time being I pushed the tractor back into the garage
> (man that
> >> thing is heavy - especially when you're pushing it up a hill).
> Got a good
> >> workout though. :)
> >> It may just be that the fuel gauge is reading low due to some
> additional
> >> resistance somewhere in the path (perhaps at the fuse holder),
> but I'm also
> >> suspicious that the pack may have been slowly discharging through
> some
> >> short somewhere - so I disconnected the negative-most battery
> terminal.
> >> Apparently something other than just the fuse did blow, I just
> need to
> >> figure out what. What could cause this symptom of no power to
> anything? The
> >> fuel gauge meter was showing nothing also, until I tried
> soldering that
> >> fuse holder connection - but perhaps I shouldn't have done that.
> When I
> >> then decided to check the resistance between the fuses themselves
> and the
> >> wires connected to the terminals on the fuseholders for the other
> two
> >> fuses, they also seem to have no connection (between the fuse and
> the
> >> screws on the fuse block) - don't know if they were like that
> initially, if
> >> they're supposed to be that way, or if I screwed something up
> when
> >> soldering that one fuse block.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Mike
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> --------------------------------------------------------------
> >> Michael S. Briggs
> >> UNH Physics Department
> >> (603) 862-2828
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> On Sat, 29 Jul 2006, RJ Kanary wrote:
> >>
> >>> Once again, I will ask what flavor of E-15 you have. Since
> they have
> >>> three different wiring configurations, knowing which revision
> yours is,
> >>> {AA, BA and so on.} would help me help you. The pertinent
> information is
> >>> on the data plate under the hood.
> >>> Thanks.
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael S Briggs"
> >>> <msbriggs alberti unh edu>
> >>> To: <elec-trak cosmos phy tufts edu>
> >>> Sent: Saturday, July 29, 2006 4:08 PM
> >>> Subject: (ET) ok, not the fusible link
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Found a post from Wombat in the archives saying where the
> fusible link is
> >>>> - just a wire going across two terminals on the Power
> Disconnect. Ok, so
> >>>> the fusible link is fine, so it's apparnetly something else.
> >>>> Based on the wisps of smoke that came up around the speed
> lever,
> >>>> it seems reasonable to suspect something underneath it may have
> blown.
> >>>> There's that big ol relay down underneath there - but that's
> just the PTO
> >>>> contactor. Unless it's failure mode is creating a short across
> the
> >>>> batteries, I can't see that being the problem, since it's not
> just the
> >>>> PTO
> >>>> that's not working - nothing is.
> >>>> I suppose the smoke could have come from something in the
> speed
> >>>> control itself, but that shouldn't cause the no power at all
> problem (at
> >>>> least from looking at the schematics, I don't think it should).
> >>>> From looking at the Troubleshooting sketch schematic for the
> E-15
> >>>> in the manual, and just looking at what might result in the
> fuel level
> >>>> gauge not seeing squat, the only things between the fuel level
> gauge and
> >>>> the batteries (so the only things that keep it from reading
> batt voltage)
> >>>> are:
> >>>> 1. Power Use gauge - checked it with the multimeter, it's fine.
> >>>> 2. 20 Amp fuse 3 - it blew initially, I replaced it with 20 amp
> light
> >>>> fuse
> >>>> for the moment.
> >>>> 3. Wire 13 goes from that fuse to the PTO coil (is this the PTO
>
> >>>> contactor?
> >>>> Or some other coil?), but you don't seem to need to have a
> connection
> >>>> THROUGH the coil for the fuel gauge, since line 13 comes off of
> that same
> >>>> connection point on the terminal, and continues to the fuel
> gauge - on
> >>>> the
> >>>> negative side of it.
> >>>> 4. Line 5 comes off the + side of the fuel gauge, goes to fuse
> 2 (the
> >>>> lift
> >>>> fuse, but doesn't go through it, just connects to one end of
> it, and
> >>>> continues on from that same connection point), continues to the
> L
> >>>> contactor, but not through it, and to circuit breaker 1. Hm,
> haven't
> >>>> checked that yet - isn't that the main circuit breaker on the
> back of the
> >>>> panel that has the forward/reverse relay and such on it? I
> pressed it to
> >>>> reset in case it was the issue, but it seemed to be fine. I'll
> check
> >>>> again
> >>>> in a minute just in case.
> >>>> 5. Power Disconnect, which presumably doesn't itself fail in
> any way -
> >>>> I'll check though.
> >>>> 6. Fusible link - fine.
> >>>> 7. And then to the + side of the pack.
> >>>>
> >>>> So, presumably something in there is failed. I'll head back out
> with my
> >>>> multimeter and trace the line all around.
> >>>> This is kinda fun, albeit somewhat frustrating, since I had
> other
> >>>> things I wanted to do.
> >>>>
> >>>> Mike
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>>
> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>> Michael S. Briggs
> >>>> UNH Physics Department
> >>>> (603) 862-2828
> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Elec-trak mailing list
> >>>> Elec-trak cosmos phy tufts edu
> >>>> https://cosmos.phy.tufts.edu/mailman/listinfo/elec-trak
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >