Re: (ET) gm car

[Bfayette aol com]

I think this is part of a much larger effort to develop fuel cell cars.  
The EV1 was simply a test bed for the electrical components. The next step 
is hydrocarbon fuel cells. While that's gaining acceptance, the 
infrastructure to distribute hydrogen can be built.

GM spent $300 million to buld those cars and lease them for $500 a month.  
They did not do that for the money. EV folks sometimes go on a conspiricy 
jag when it comes to EVs and the domestic car companies, but I personally 
think GM is to be commended for thier efforts in this area.

I wonder what they are going to do with them.  I hope they don't crush 
them like Crysler did with the turbine cars.

BTW, thanks to all for the advice on controllers and lubrication.  I will 
have something going in time to mow.  

Regards,

Brad Fayette



In a message dated 3/12/2003 8:39:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, pctrice 
purdue edu writes:

> 
> 
> Peter,
>    You make as number of good points vis a vis the cost of
> producing an EV. However, I would hesitate to say that the
> infrastructure is not there. In fact, compared to, say, *hydrogen*
> powered vehicles, most of the infrastructure is already in place for
> refueling EVs. Think of it; we have electricity in most homes, at most
> places of work, even on most street corners. The processes required to
> produce, transport, and utilize elctricity are well known, in place, and
> far down on the economy-of-scale.
>    On the other hand, think of the work to be done in order to
> bring up an equivalent infrastructure to refuel with hydrogen. Sure, the
> raw materials are readily available, and renewable, but the technology
> to produce, transport, store, deliver, and meter it is in its infancy.
> Particularly if you consider the scale  on which gasoline is now
> available. 
>    I dunno. In the mid-70s, I actually thought that
> alternative-energy development would take off. Even now, there's a part
> of me that twitches with the optimism that it could happen again. Any
> others in the audience?
> 
>    -Phil Trice
>    West Lafayette, IN
>    Sears Electric parts-on-the-floor project
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-elec-trak cosmos phy tufts edu
> [mailto:owner-elec-trak cosmos phy tufts edu] On Behalf Of Pieter
> Litchfield
> Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 7:12 AM
> To: Discussion List Electrac tractor
> Subject: Re: (ET) gm car
> 
> 
> Well don't condemn GM too soon.  There isn't any infrastructure out
> there, little public acceptance (except here).  I think they were leased
> because GM didn't want to have owners "stranded" down the road, giving
> the perception that GM was acting unethically by selling a product that
> it wouldn't support.  At least with all the leased vehicles off the
> road, we can't say GM unfairly abandoned us.
> 
> For the moment, it appears that hybrids are gaining acceptance.
> 
> Does anyone know of a study that attempts to quantify all the costs of
> building and operating a vehicle?  Manufacturing, raw materials, fuel,
> fuel transpiration,disposal, etc?  I love my ET, but I'm not convinced
> when all is taken into account that it is an economic choice.  For
> example, while the vehicle itself is "clean", the power plant that made
> the Kws to charge it is not.  But it can be or a cost.  IInterestingly,
> the pollution from the mid-west falls where I live, so my advocating for
> more electric vehicles could have a real personal "cost" to me.  Anyway,
> that Kw must be transported on the grid with losses, transformed
> (producing heat) to charge the battery, and stored in a medium that
> produces a chemical reaction resulting in a bit of gas discharge. In
> addition, the batteries contain lead which has a disposal cost
> encountered every few years.  And we have barely scratched the surface
> of costs. So what are the "true" costs of producing and using an ET (or
> any EV) compared to, say, a John Deere of comparable HP? No taking
> sides, just curious.
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "William Korthof" <wkorthof earthlink net>
> To: "Neil Dennis" <wombat dssinternet net>; "Elec-trak"
> <elec-trak cosmos phy tufts edu>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2003 8:41 PM
> Subject: Re: (ET) gm car
> 
> 
> > Yeah, by hook and by crook GM is yanking away
> > each of the EV1 electric cars from the "owners"
> > as quickly as they legally can. It's a shame GM
> > stopped EV1 production (a long time ago!). But
> > it's also disappointing that they refused to allow
> > anyone to buy an EV1 (lease only!) for _any_
> > price from the start to the end. Many thousands
> > of EV1 wannabe "wait list" EV customer were
> > turned away as well, and now every single EV1
> > ---1000+ or so---is being taken off the road.
> >
> > Boy am I glad GM is so enthusiastic about
> > building technology for the future. not.
> >
> > /wk
> >
> > At 06:59 PM 3/11/03 -0500, Neil Dennis wrote:
> > >An announcment in the news tonight, GM is recalling 
> their electric 
> > >car and going out of the business.
> > >
> > >Kinda a downer {)-{
> > >
> > >wombat
> >

  Brad