Re: (ET) Snow at last...

[David C Robie <mycroftxx1 juno com>]

Agreed with most of it Dave - but assume that the guys on this board are
aready educated (by hard knocks mainly, I bet) as to what are good tools
and what are bad ones.  Example.  No carpenter or machinist would even
own any level with a base so short as the lasers on the market anywhere,
regardless of price.  Homeowners would, for hanging pictures inline or
putting up shelving. Most of em I've run across don't know how to snap a
chalkline or even know what one is. (incidentally, had a laser level,
tried it, and went back to the old plumb and chalk which is more
accurate.  Later, the laser was stolen when I attempted to yardsale it. 
I laughed).

    Most of HF's items are for non-professionals they wouldn't stand the
day after day use a pro would give em.  
But for a hobby type shop (which most of us have) these Chinese knockoffs
are fine.  And if used and abused they are cheap enough to throw away. 
Have only thrown away one cheap HF - flea mkt type air tool in all the
yrs I've had shop air and that's cause I wore it out (took bout 20 yrs). 
A $15 3" 'whizzer wheel' grinder which is the most used air tool I got. 
The rest are fine.
  As to HF VOM meters;  I wouldn't use one of em on anything so critical
as a controller,  would instead use one of the 'three digits after the
decimal' ones I have here, one a bench Fluke. The use for these cheapies
is to bring em to locations and environments where you would not bring a
good meter for fear of wrecking it (or leaving it outdoors in the rain,
or dropping it in the lake or spilling something on it) or as a spare to
keep with you in the truck to fix grandma's reading lamp with.  It also
don't hurt if it gets stolen while at a job site - true of any cheap
tool.  The construction don't matter much on these.  So they bust after 5
yrs.  So get another $3.00 one.   None of mine have failed except for
batteries.  All of us EV guys in New England use em, and most keep one in
the vehicle toolbox.

   The HF catalog is also a 'truth table' regarding price.  A lot of
stores even flea markets sell the same stuff and how are we to know what
to pay without a comparison. Just about anything a home shop guy could
want is in there, along with it's picture.  Have yet to see any store or
display with it's variety.
    Using your noggin, would you buy a tool  that you know will demand
heavy continued or super precise use at the cheapest price?  Of course
not.  That's what  the professional tools are there for.  But for light
intermittent duty such as home shop, HF gives the best alternative we
got, and allows a greater variety of seldom - maybe once a year - used
tools to be had for the same investment.  Therefore, a more well equipped
shop able to do more diverse work.

Resting my case
Dave
Weymouth MA
 


On Fri, 09 Feb 2007 14:43:34 -0500 "David Roden" <etpost drmm net>
writes:
> > Harbor Freight ...  Everyone with a shop should have that catalog.
> 
> Yeah.  They make excellent fire starters. 
> 
> I don't mean to be argumentative or provocative, but the comment 
> above 
> touched a nerve.  "Everyone with a shop should have that catalog" 
> only if 
> he's a masochist!  
> 
> HF is for people whose only criterion is initial purchase price.  
> They sell
> cheap, cr@ppy, frustrating, use-once-and-throw-away tools.  
> 
> Once in a while you'll find something decent there, but HF sell a 
> LOT of 
> absolute junk.  "Made in China" must be their mantra.  
> 
> Not long ago, I received a laser level from HF as a gift.  This 
> "level" 
> wasn't.  It was so far off it was laughable.  It might be useful as 
> a toy, 
> but for the fact that the laser could hurt the kid's eyes.  
> 
> I've seen their $5 DMMs.  They're essentially identical to the one I 
> got 
> thrown in as a freebie when I bought a pile of stuff from one of the 
> 
> electronics surplus catalogs about 10 years ago.  It was tolerably 
> accurate 
> at room temperature, but variable in a cold garage.   
> 
> One day it quit working altogether.  When I opened it up, I found 
> chip-on- 
> board construction.  This is the same dirt-cheap assembly method 
> used for 
> musical greeting cards - literally, disposable electronics, designed 
> to work 
> for only a few months or years.  
> 
> In this type of construction, a microchip is mounted not in a 
> clean-room-
> sealed ceramic package, but right to the PC board.   It's not 
> soldered; it's 
> just laid on top of the contacts and cemented in place.  Of course, 
> eventually moisture and air contaminants work their way between the 
> contacts 
> and the chip's connections.  They oxidize and lose contact.  The 
> gadget 
> stops working.  By then the warranty (if any) is long expired.  
> 
> So, you're thinking, when it quits you just throw it away and buy a 
> new one. 
> Sure, the $150 or so you'd spend for a decent Fluke buys a lot of $5 
> HF 
> meters.  But what if you make an adjustment incorrectly because of 
> its 
> inaccuracy, and destroy a $700 controller?  What about the 
> environmental 
> impact of repeatedly manufacturing and discarding products?  
> 
> Even if you're really only going to use them once, you'll get 
> nothing but 
> frustration from cheap tools.  I know this from experience.  Ask me 
> about my 
> budget strut spring compressor.  
> 
> I admit that I didn't always listen to my father, but I had my ears 
> (mostly) 
> open the day he told me that cheap tools are never a bargain.  And 
> bless 
> him, when he left this world he left me 3 big toolboxes full of d@mn 
> fine 
> hand tools - all of which still serve me well, almost 25 years 
> later.  
> 
> 
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> 
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