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Re: (ET) ok, not the fusible link

If CB-1 is open, NOTHING works. Including the lift motor. Also the RTN circuits. No RTN, no PTO.CB-2, on the firewall, prevents the firewall taking on the literal sense of the term in the event that one of the charger diodes should fail shorted. As far as repairing the fuse holder.........depends on your determination.While you are pondering that, get an inline fuse holder, splice it in, and get this thing working.We're burning daylight here, and soon it will be snow plowing time...................
----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael S Briggs" <msbriggs alberti unh edu> 
To: "RJ Kanary" <rjkanary nauticom net>
Cc: <elec-trak cosmos phy tufts edu>
Sent: Saturday, July 29, 2006 10:08 PM
Subject: Re: (ET) ok, not the fusible link




RJ,
 Alrighty, will do (tomorrow morning). It will be my first time
doing anything on the drive motor - haven't touched it yet.
 Kind of funny - based on the schematics, I figured it could be
CB-1 - but I thought that was the thermal breaker near the fuse panel. :)
 It may have failed - but it's seeming now like it should be
something else, since after soldering that control fuse holder, I am
seeing some voltage on the fuel gauge (doesn't seem to be reading
accurately though), and from the schematic, it looks like the fuel gauge
shouldn't read anything if CB-1 is open. Also, the PTO outlet isn't
working, and CB-1 isn't on that circuit (at least it looks that way from
the schematic).
 On the fuse holder - is there any way to fix the old one, or
should the whole thing be replaced? So far, it's seemed like my attempt at
soldering the connection there hasn't been very effective.
 Hm, just realized that I haven't tried running the lift motor
since it died - I'm assuming it doesn't work, but knowing for sure might
help isolate the problem. I'll try that in the morning too.

Thanks,
Mike

--

--------------------------------------------------------------
Michael S. Briggs
UNH Physics Department
(603) 862-2828
---------------------------------------------------------------

On Sat, 29 Jul 2006, RJ Kanary wrote:
Knowing now that you have an AA model..................<VBG>, I can tell you that the early fuse holders were problematic. What ever fault cause the 
fuse to open could well have finished off the holder as well.
Remember that bad high current connection that I suspected that you may have, due to the motorboating and chattering that you had ? I think that you just may find it now. Take a look at CB-1, that large Klixon® thermal limiter on the traction motor case . If it has failed open, nothing would power up, 
including the "Fuel Gauge".
       Fix the fuse holder, investigate CB-1, and report back with your
findings. :)

----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael S Briggs"
<msbriggs alberti unh edu>
To: "RJ Kanary" <rjkanary nauticom net>
Cc: <elec-trak cosmos phy tufts edu>
Sent: Saturday, July 29, 2006 9:08 PM
Subject: Re: (ET) ok, not the fusible link




RJ,
 Mine's an AA.
 An update on what I've looked over:
 Since the fuel gauge wasn't showing anything, I decided to try tracking
the path around it to see where the path was broken. From the positive end of the pack to the fuel gauge was fine, the problem was on the end from the - end of the pack to the fuel gauge. The path was fine to the fuse holder, and fine from the fuel gauge to the side of the fuse holder closest to it. So, that would seem to indicate blown fuse - but the fuse was fine. What I 
ended up finding was that with the fuse in the fuse holder, it had no
connection to the screw terminal where the wires connect.
I tried just cleaning everything out well, filing off any possible rust, 
and then sprayed it down with De-Oxit cleaner, but still nothing.
The rivet connection where the fuse holder is connected to the plate that the screw is on (where the wires connect) was loose and wobbly, apparently not making a good connection. The other fuse holders looked nice and tight at that rivet, but not this one - so I figured maybe I had somehow weakened 
the rivet when I pulled out the blown fuse to replace it.
So, I figured I'd try soldering that connection to make a better contact between the fuse holder and the screwed in connections. That may not have been a great idea (that block with the fuse holders connected doesn't seem to like the heat), but it did at least get it where now when I engage the power disconnect, I do get a reading on the fuel meter gauge - but it was 
much lower than it should have been, and still nothing works - no drive
motor, no PTO, etc..
So, for the time being I pushed the tractor back into the garage (man that thing is heavy - especially when you're pushing it up a hill). Got a good 
workout though. :)
It may just be that the fuel gauge is reading low due to some additional resistance somewhere in the path (perhaps at the fuse holder), but I'm also 
suspicious that the pack may have been slowly discharging through some
short somewhere - so I disconnected the negative-most battery terminal.
 Apparently something other than just the fuse did blow, I just need to
figure out what. What could cause this symptom of no power to anything? The 
fuel gauge meter was showing nothing also, until I tried soldering that
fuse holder connection - but perhaps I shouldn't have done that. When I
then decided to check the resistance between the fuses themselves and the 
wires connected to the terminals on the fuseholders for the other two
fuses, they also seem to have no connection (between the fuse and the
screws on the fuse block) - don't know if they were like that initially, if 
they're supposed to be that way, or if I screwed something up when
soldering that one fuse block.

Thanks,
Mike

--

--------------------------------------------------------------
Michael S. Briggs
UNH Physics Department
(603) 862-2828
---------------------------------------------------------------

On Sat, 29 Jul 2006, RJ Kanary wrote:


  Once again, I will ask what flavor of E-15 you have. Since they have
three different wiring configurations, knowing which revision yours is,
{AA, BA and so on.} would help me help you. The pertinent information is 
on the data plate under the hood.
Thanks.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael S Briggs"
<msbriggs alberti unh edu>
To: <elec-trak cosmos phy tufts edu>
Sent: Saturday, July 29, 2006 4:08 PM
Subject: (ET) ok, not the fusible link
Found a post from Wombat in the archives saying where the fusible link is - just a wire going across two terminals on the Power Disconnect. Ok, so 
the fusible link is fine, so it's apparnetly something else.
 Based on the wisps of smoke that came up around the speed lever,
it seems reasonable to suspect something underneath it may have blown.
There's that big ol relay down underneath there - but that's just the PTO 
contactor. Unless it's failure mode is creating a short across the
batteries, I can't see that being the problem, since it's not just the
PTO
that's not working - nothing is.
 I suppose the smoke could have come from something in the speed
control itself, but that shouldn't cause the no power at all problem (at 
least from looking at the schematics, I don't think it should).
 From looking at the Troubleshooting sketch schematic for the E-15
in the manual, and just looking at what might result in the fuel level
gauge not seeing squat, the only things between the fuel level gauge and the batteries (so the only things that keep it from reading batt voltage) 
are:
1. Power Use gauge - checked it with the multimeter, it's fine.
2. 20 Amp fuse 3 - it blew initially, I replaced it with 20 amp light
fuse
for the moment.
3. Wire 13 goes from that fuse to the PTO coil (is this the PTO
contactor?
Or some other coil?), but you don't seem to need to have a connection
THROUGH the coil for the fuel gauge, since line 13 comes off of that same 
connection point on the terminal, and continues to the fuel gauge - on
the
negative side of it.
4. Line 5 comes off the + side of the fuel gauge, goes to fuse 2 (the
lift
fuse, but doesn't go through it, just connects to one end of it, and
continues on from that same connection point), continues to the L
contactor, but not through it, and to circuit breaker 1. Hm, haven't
checked that yet - isn't that the main circuit breaker on the back of the panel that has the forward/reverse relay and such on it? I pressed it to 
reset in case it was the issue, but it seemed to be fine. I'll check
again
in a  minute just in case.
5. Power Disconnect, which presumably doesn't itself fail in any way -
I'll check though.
6. Fusible link - fine.
7. And then to the + side of the pack.
So, presumably something in there is failed. I'll head back out with my 
multimeter and trace the line all around.
 This is kinda fun, albeit somewhat frustrating, since I had other
things I wanted to do.

Mike

--

--------------------------------------------------------------
Michael S. Briggs
UNH Physics Department
(603) 862-2828
---------------------------------------------------------------

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